Cracked Frame at Rear Pin

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Re: Cracked Frame at Rear Pin

Postby economod » Sat Feb 06, 2016 7:58 am

Yesterday, I fired 20 successful rounds of short BrassMaxx thru the CPX, bringing the total fired to 500rds.
I won't shoot it too much anymore. Owning the CPX has been a learning experience, and a $250 mistake.
Needs endless repair, has ammo sensitive mags, features DAO inaccuracy, and is too big for pocket-draw.
Frequent factory repairs negate confidence & waste ammo. Better guns are both available & affordable.
The prepaid-shipping lifetime repair warranty is a hollow substitute for cumulative design improvements.

Feeding & extraction failures, caused by case material & overall length, prohibit inexpensive bulk ammo.
The no-retention solid-dowel front frame pin moved slightly, causing polymer frame to crack at rear pin.
Magazine springs: backward. Slide hold & mag release springs: detached. Trigger return spring: too weak.
Long Weak Trigger Reset >> its WORST design flaw << very susceptible to Short-Stroke under Duress.
Thanks to forum members past/present, whose revolving input helps expose/confirm repetitious defects.

I also fired 50rds UMC thru my new B6P. It's a great range/HD gun that I should have purchased years ago.
Slender, lightweight, full-size with an accurate DA/SA trigger, and uses quality Mec-Gar CZ75B 17rd mags.
It conceals comfortably under a loose sweatshirt, OWB in a versatile Tagua Gunleather belt slide holster.
The B6P is MUCH better design/build, is more fun, shoots cheaper ammo & cost $16 less than the CPX.
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Re: Cracked Frame at Rear Pin

Postby economod » Wed Mar 23, 2016 5:46 pm

economod wrote:Maybe two small frame pins would be adequate IF the receiver fit tighter into the frame.
Maybe this loose-in-frame receiver is causing the extraction fails ... the mag is independent of the receiver.
Where's the 9mm polymer beef? One more ounce, please.
The .380acp should do very well in this lightweight frame.

getvicious wrote:SCCY's answer to the cracking frames was to slightly change the frame and (I think) reinforce the rear a bit. At least when you get your CPX back it will have a new frame.

Actually, my old aluminum receiver now fits tighter in the new polymer frame because of a wooden shim. :shock:
The wooden shim is between the rear face of the receiver and the polymer frame, ahead of the rear frame pin.
Perhaps the next owners manual will give that wooden shim a new name / part number ... frame buffer?
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Re: Cracked Frame at Rear Pin

Postby getvicious » Wed Mar 23, 2016 10:26 pm

Please post a picture of the shim in the pistol.
It's not the blast that kills you - It's the tumble to the bottom of the 800 foot crater.....
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Re: Cracked Frame at Rear Pin

Postby arcus10mm » Thu Mar 24, 2016 1:03 am

get a patent on it ----- edit- did you or sccy put in the shim???
Last edited by arcus10mm on Thu Mar 24, 2016 9:50 am, edited 3 times in total.
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Re: Cracked Frame at Rear Pin

Postby economod » Thu Mar 24, 2016 7:35 am

Toothpick-Left-crop.jpg

See the rear face of the slide rail of the receiver, on both left and right sides.
From top view looking down, there are two small gaps between the aluminum and the polymer.
Imagine forcing a toothpick into each gap, and snapping it off flush with the frame ledge.
That's what it looks like.

To be perfectly clear, this is how it came back to me from SCCY. Ask their main armorer.

Un-pinned, the receiver can move front-to-back within the frame. Two pins locate it in the frame.
The force of recoil is transferred to the receiver thru the lower half-round of the guide rod.
If/when the front pin walks out of position, the receiver uses the gaps for rearward movement.
This loose-in-frame receiver slams its force against the rear frame pin alone, cracking polymer.

Filling the tiny gaps on each side eliminates the space-to-move, and hopefully saves polymer.
The force is transferred from the rear faces of the receiver, thru the shims and into the frame.
1) The gaps must be filled (with something solid) to exclude the force from the rear pin.
2) The frame pins must not move out of position.

BTW, when the receiver moves rearward, the chamber gets closer to the magazine.
So close, in fact, that it causes extraction interference! > > WHAT?? Longer ammo fails??
:shock:

This has been going on for years.

This is a serious defect. Either the tolerances need to be tightened, or a dimension needs to change.
Either the problem hasn't been thoroughly defined, or is deemed economically unfeasible to resolve.
WHY doesn't ALUMINUM or POLYMER permanently fill these gaps in my $250 lemon?

SCCY touts the use of quality materials. uhh ... spruce-pine-fir, cedar, hemlock ... best fps lumber?
Last edited by economod on Sun Mar 27, 2016 9:30 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Cracked Frame at Rear Pin

Postby economod » Thu Mar 24, 2016 1:00 pm

Yeah, since my "before-the-bell" post, UPS opened low this morning. But it has recovered this afternoon.
Perhaps some information was circulated between fund managers at champagne lunch that we're not yet privy to.
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Re: Cracked Frame at Rear Pin

Postby getvicious » Thu Mar 24, 2016 2:20 pm

economod - Interesting stuff in your post from this morning - thanks.
It's not the blast that kills you - It's the tumble to the bottom of the 800 foot crater.....
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Re: Cracked Frame at Rear Pin

Postby economod » Thu Mar 24, 2016 2:51 pm

I'm stunned ... that an OEM would remedy what is clearly a factory defect in a $250 weapon with such a cheap and temporary quick-fix. I guess that's why they no longer provide a description of services after a warranty repair.
I've had a rough year. But I find it most difficult to accept the realization that I was ever stupid enough to pay good money for this confidence-draining ammo-wasting defective excuse of a product. Better days ahead.
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Re: Cracked Frame at Rear Pin

Postby spentprimer » Thu Mar 24, 2016 6:06 pm

economod wrote:I'm stunned ... that an OEM would remedy what is clearly a factory defect in a $250 weapon with such a cheap and temporary quick-fix. I guess that's why they no longer provide a description of services after a warranty repair.
I've had a rough year. But I find it most difficult to accept the realization that I was ever stupid enough to pay good money for this confidence-draining ammo-wasting excuse of a product. Better days ahead.


I am hoping, although, maybe praying would be better, that my new CPX-2 is immune to the problems that have plagued you and yours. I must admit, I always thought Zytel to be a bit fragile and prone to cracking in high impact applications ... I may be wrong here as I am old and tired. I have seen a few of the videos on-line with similar issues and would hope a real remedy is in the works.
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Re: Cracked Frame at Rear Pin

Postby economod » Thu Mar 24, 2016 6:15 pm

spentprimer ... Keep a close eye on the two frame pins. They are known to walk out of position. If so, push them back in and center them the best you can. Apply superglue to try to keep them in place. SCCY may send you oversize pins upon request, which might fit tighter than the originals. Good luck. Welcome to the forum. hth

FYI - my front pin only moved 1/32" and never protruded from the frame, yet it was enough to cause a crack.
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Re: Cracked Frame at Rear Pin

Postby arcus10mm » Thu Mar 24, 2016 6:28 pm

economod wrote:spentprimer ... Keep a close eye on the two frame pins. They are known to walk out of position. If so, push them back in and center them the best you can. Apply superglue to try to keep them in place. SCCY may send you oversize pins upon request, which might fit tighter than the originals. Good luck. Welcome to the forum. hth

FYI - my front pin only moved 1/32" and never protruded from the frame, yet it was enough to crack the frame.

and if all else fails -------------- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oJgF_HQafvA
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Re: Cracked Frame at Rear Pin

Postby spentprimer » Thu Mar 24, 2016 8:07 pm

arcus10mm wrote:
economod wrote:spentprimer ... Keep a close eye on the two frame pins. They are known to walk out of position. If so, push them back in and center them the best you can. Apply superglue to try to keep them in place. SCCY may send you oversize pins upon request, which might fit tighter than the originals. Good luck. Welcome to the forum. hth

FYI - my front pin only moved 1/32" and never protruded from the frame, yet it was enough to crack the frame.

and if all else fails -------------- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oJgF_HQafvA


I have used that stuff on a number of improbable repairs and I must confess there have been pleasant surprises that have resulted from it's use. Most notably a 1, 000 gallon water tank with 1/2" X 2.5' gash near the bottom. I think I will pass on the frame fix however.
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Re: Cracked Frame at Rear Pin

Postby economod » Sat Mar 26, 2016 9:30 am

spentprimer wrote:I have used that stuff on a number of improbable repairs and I must confess there have been pleasant surprises that have resulted from it's use. Most notably a 1, 000 gallon water tank with 1/2" X 2.5' gash near the bottom.
I think I will pass on the frame fix however.

Yeah, I'm not real impressed either.

SCCY used a toothpick? :shock: to cushion my receiver, so my frame won't crack again.
... just in case my front frame pin starts to walk out of position, again.

WTF. I used to try to like this thing, but not anymore. Paid waay too much. Wasted too much ammo. Makes me sick.
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Re: Cracked Frame at Rear Pin

Postby arcus10mm » Sat Mar 26, 2016 10:03 am

coating a std pin with silicone had "some" so-so results ==== im going to try Butyl-Flex (roof glue) im thinking that what was used on one of its to-many return trips.................
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Re: Cracked Frame at Rear Pin

Postby tripleb » Sat Mar 26, 2016 10:32 am

After about 500 rounds, my front pin has decided to walk also. Not certain what I am going to do to remedy the problem ... I do not use the CPX as a "daily" shooter so it's no big deal to me. However, I am thinking that I will replace the front pin the a roll pin or drill and tap and use pan head screws if the problem starts to "bug" me.
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