Kel-tec P11 Recoil Rod Assembly Comparison

For the general discussion of SCCY Industries firearms. Includes the SCCY CPX-1 and CPX-2 compact 9mm handguns.

Kel-tec P11 Recoil Rod Assembly Comparison

Postby jax gunslinger » Tue Apr 03, 2012 11:39 am

First of all I would like to give credit to Sccy Forum member "Navy Steve" for providing his CPX for comparison purposes. :D

The KT parts fit into the CPX with no problems. They were a little bit harder to install since they are loose parts, and not one assembly. The CPX encapsulated design is already partially compressed, which helps make it easier to install. The gun went back together perfectly with no issue. The slide functioned perfectly, but with a little more snap when racking. The P11 spring set seemed a little stiffer. The PF-9 spring set might be a touch lighter, due to the shorter size. The P40's springs may make it stiffer, but with less recoil. We assembled and dis-assembled the gun several times with no problems. We plan on hitting the range in the next couple days, and will provide a range report as to how well it functions.

The top picture shows the guide rods and spring sets for both the Kel-tec P11 and PF-9. P11 parts on the left side of the PF-9 parts. The guide rods seem to be identical in size. The P11 spring set was a couple turns longer than the PF-9.


attachment=0]PF9 and PF11 guide rod and spring sets.jpg[/attachment]

The bottom picture shows the CPX assembly next to the kel-tec.

[
PF9 and PF11 guide rod and spring sets.jpg


The bottom set of pictures shows the KT guide rod assy. installed on the CPX barrel laying in the slide.

The top set of pictures shows the factory CPX guide rod assembly installed on the CPX barrel laying in the slide.
Attachments
cpx top view.jpg
cpx side view.jpg
kt GR installed  side view.jpg
kel tec guide rod installed on CPX barrel.jpg
Scyy CPX and Kel-tec comparison guide rod assy..jpg
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Re: Kel-tec P11 Recoil Rod Assembly Comparison

Postby Radarscratch » Fri Apr 06, 2012 12:25 pm

I just received my p11 asssembly in the mail, $2 shipped.

One this I noticed after opening the package was the head of the rod. It looked like it was snapped.off a chutes and ladder game. Rough in one spot and plastic protruding. Hum....
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Re: Kel-tec P11 Recoil Rod Assembly Comparison

Postby jax gunslinger » Fri Apr 06, 2012 1:20 pm

Alot of the guide rods have a flash mark in the middle, not an issue. You can sand it smooth if you like. Does the slide cycle?
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Re: Kel-tec P11 Recoil Rod Assembly Comparison

Postby getvicious » Sat Apr 07, 2012 2:17 am

It looked like it was snapped.off a chutes and ladder game. Rough in one spot and plastic protruding. Hum....

Poor quality control. You shouldn't need to trim / smooth / buff any new part from anybody. But unless there's an after-market producer to encourage a little competition we just have to deal with "fixing" new parts.

I hope your test goes well. It will be nice to have a cheap fix option for those who continue to have issues with the stock recoil rod.
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Re: Kel-tec P11 Recoil Rod Assembly Comparison

Postby jax gunslinger » Sat Apr 07, 2012 6:55 am

The factory part we're talking about really does not need sanding, but you can if you like. But, I agree with your statement on competion and quality control.
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Re: Kel-tec P11 Recoil Rod Assembly Comparison

Postby jax gunslinger » Mon Apr 09, 2012 3:49 pm

UPDATE: Navy Steve and I went to the range today and op checked the P11's re-coil rod and spring assy. in his 2nd gen CPX-1. We fired approximately 30 rounds through the CPX without an issue. After the 30 rounds we switched out the re-coil assys. back to the original Sccy Parts, and fired the gun again. Neither of us noticed any difference in recoil or any other factor with the $2 kel-tec parts. For those of you who have had issues with the factory Sccy recoil assy, you now have a working option. For $2 how can you go wrong? :kickback:
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Re: Kel-tec P11 Recoil Rod Assembly Comparison

Postby Radarscratch » Wed Apr 11, 2012 5:13 pm

Well, I got impatient and ordered the KelTec P11 rod as well. The P11 was delivered about the same day as the "revised" SCCY rod. Below are some pictures...Warning...my gun is dirty so please don't be offended...


comparison-1.jpg




compare-2.jpg




compare-3.jpg




p11_installed.jpg




p11_installed2.jpg
Last edited by Radarscratch on Wed Apr 11, 2012 8:42 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Kel-tec P11 Recoil Rod Assembly Comparison

Postby jax gunslinger » Wed Apr 11, 2012 5:27 pm

Very nice pictures, This link may need to be stickyfied. :) Have you had a chance to shoot it with the P11 rod and springs? Whats your opinion on the brass washer modified Sccy offering? :?:
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Re: Kel-tec P11 Recoil Rod Assembly Comparison

Postby Radarscratch » Wed Apr 11, 2012 8:55 pm

Jax,

I haven't taken the CPX to the range yet, with the Kel Tec rod. The "warranty" conscious side of me says to not use any non SCCY parts. However, from cycling the slide a number of times it does appear a bit snappier :wink: I'm not sure if that good or bad yet, I'm not a very experienced shooter yet (working on it though :) )

Regarding the brass washer, as you know brass is softer than a lot of the metals used in handguns. I don't know the exact chemical makeup of this washer, but it will have very low friction and should last far longer than plastics.

I've put the new and improvised rod in my CPX-1 and I'm going to try and make it to the range tomorrow. I doubt I'll notice any differences.
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Re: Kel-tec P11 Recoil Rod Assembly Comparison

Postby getvicious » Wed Apr 11, 2012 11:06 pm

This is a very interesting issue to me. When I was initially looking for a Conceal Carry pistol I had pretty well decided on a P11, before I had come across the CPX-1. I had found the KTOG forum and looked around in there quite a bit. There is a lot of good info there and I learned a lot.

What's interesting is that I found a very spirited discussion on KTOG about the recoil rod in the P11. That discussion was exactly a mirror image of the discussion here. There people were complaining about the plastic recoil rod and wanted a metal one. I even seem to remember people saying Kel-Tec was offering a metal recoil rod for sale as an accessory on their site.

I don't know if a plastic recoil rod is superior or inferior to a metal rod. I do believe both have advantages and disadvantages. I know that the vast majority of P11 and CPX owners have no issues with their pistols and real issues with both pistols are pretty rare.

I just think it's funny how the "better" solution seems to depend on where you start and, to many people, the "better" solution is the stock choice used in the other pistol. :lol:
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Re: Kel-tec P11 Recoil Rod Assembly Comparison

Postby jax gunslinger » Thu Apr 12, 2012 5:57 am

Radar..... KT recoil springs when they are new are very stiff, but they break in with use. GV......I've never read anything on the P11's recoil system causing problems like the Sccy's have. What I have read were folks concerned about the nylon/plastic rod being cheesy and flimsy looking. Those folks wanted a metal version, which KT produced for them as an accessory. The problem with the metal rod in my opinion would be wear inside the slide hole. Cheaper to replace $2 plastic part than $100 slide assy. Once again KT says the origin part for the most part will last the life of the firearm. I'm sure some may have had issues here or there, probably from not holding the barrel down while assembling or dis-assembling. It would be nice if Sccy would produce an alternate Kel-tec style version as an accessory for their customers who, like Radar don't feel comfortable running non-sccy parts in their guns. It sure wouldn't cost them much as KT only sells them for $2 including shipping. :kickback:
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Re: Kel-tec P11 Recoil Rod Assembly Comparison

Postby jax gunslinger » Fri Apr 13, 2012 12:23 pm

UPDATE: We put another 50rds through Navy Steves CPX today. The KT recoil rod system seems to be working fine. :)
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Re: Kel-tec P11 Recoil Rod Assembly Comparison

Postby mark7mod0 » Fri Apr 13, 2012 12:45 pm

Looks like the improved rod assy is a good one. I really did not have a lot of faith in it but hey, what ever works!!! Still though, no words from Jason or anyone from SCCY saying this is the fix ..... ask and we will send ...free or $$?
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Re: Kel-tec P11 Recoil Rod Assembly Comparison

Postby jax gunslinger » Thu Oct 04, 2012 7:33 pm

Thought it might be a good time to bump this thread.......
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Re: Kel-tec P11 Recoil Rod Assembly Comparison

Postby madmax » Sun Nov 18, 2012 10:07 am

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